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Fresh rubber!

11K views 56 replies 14 participants last post by  matt7tb4 
#1 ·
Gina was in to get the exhaust valve sorted out under warranty and new tyres.
When I told them I wanted new tyres, I said a 190 rear...I expected them to put Diablo 3s back on, but they’re Diablo 2s. I don’t mind as my brother has them on his XR and likes them. It’s good to experiment.
It was also good getting back on her after the Scrambler courtesy bike...she feels like a precision weapon in comparison. Fantastic.
 

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#7 ·
It's the one in the cat. The engine light came on a couple of months ago so following advice on the forum...some from yourself, thanks Amos - I got a reader to check the issue and found out it wasn't serious. Good job because I was going on a tour a few days later. Since then I've done about 4k miles. Every so often I use the reader to turn off the engine light but it comes on again before too long. Thought I might as well get it sorted out while still in warranty.
 
#8 ·
The Diablo II are inferior to the Diablo III. On my first tire change I called my dealer and asked if they had tires in stock. They said they did; so, I took the SS in for a tire change. After I paid for it I noticed they put Diablo II on it. I told them they installed the wrong tires. They offered to put the old tires back on. I said I would keep them. They didn't stick as well as the Diablo III and they lasted a little less miles than the Diablo III.
 
#10 ·
The contact patch when the bike is vertical may be smaller, but not when leaning.

My main reason is for experimenting...that's why I'm ok with them putting the Diablo 11 on. After these are done I'll probably try Rosso Corsa's...depending on what my plans are with the bike over the following few months.

I've never tinkered with bikes when I'd had them previously (23 years ago) but knowing how much difference tyres make on quick cars, I'm keen to experiment.
 
#12 ·
I wouldn't put a 190 on a 5.5. But that's just me. If you're happy, I'm happy.

I mistakingly put a 180/60/17 on my 990 Super Duke once. I know that tire is not the same as the 190 I have on my CBR929, but it's similar. It changed the handling charicistics of the 990. And not for the better.

If the 190 is an improvement, and does all the wonderful things you've espoused, How did the experienced, educated, motivated, team of engineers at Ducati miss that?
 
#14 · (Edited)
Isn't it odd that people discredit a 190 on the SS without themself even trying it. Seems to be a lot of opinion without actually experiencing the handling.
For the curious minds, there are some individuals in here that have done and still ride with a 190 on the SS.
Rather listen to the facts from those with a 190 on the SS.

I can assure you the bike handles fine with a 190. It takes a little more countersteer but you'll very quickly adapt to it and forget there ever was a difference in the counter forces applied.
 
#15 ·
That was my thinking Amos, the 190 might have grip but at the expense of responsiveness. Personally, I like the agility with the 180 and the grip of the Rosso III. Until I ride a 190, I think I'll stick with the 180.

I have a big bike with a 170 and it it's pretty agile for being 100 lb heavier than the SS. Riders have gone to 180 and complained regarding that bike.
 
#20 ·
Unfortunately, I'm not a clued up guy. I am a curious guy. Years ago, on the old Motorush site, which was mostly Honda CBR929s, and RC51s, the doctrine back then was to go from a 190, which is on a 6" rim, to a 180. Now, it seems the opposite it supposedly true. What has changed?

I did just watch the vid from MC garage, with Ari Henning. He claims:

Wider tires don't tip in as easy requiring more counter steer, they're heavier; acceleration and braking suffer. Suspention works harder. Appropriate size rim for appropriate size rim, too big a tire on a certain sized rim creates a smaller contact patch. Has to lean farther because contact patch is farther from the center line.

I would think, but again I'm not a clued up guy, that a wider tire would require a wider rim, or the distorted profile of the tire would cause adverse effects. I tried that once, and that has been my experience.
 
#21 · (Edited)
... the doctrine back then was to go from a 190, which is on a 6" rim, to a 180. Now, it seems the opposite it supposedly true. What has changed?
I am surprised too. I always thought a wider tire in the back was used for enhanced stability (and looks!) and slightly detrimental to agility.

On the 916/996/998 family, 190/50R17 was the original factory mount. Those who rode hard (road and track), soon tested 180/55R17 on the stock rim and found out it made those superbikes significantly easier to lean from side to side, trading stability for agility. And given how demanding these bikes are when you ride hard, it made a huge difference.

People who continue riding these older bikes today still choose 180 over 190 when they want to make the bike feel a little lighter, and ride it more aggressively. I tried both. My 916 is mounted with a 180 in the back (it came with it when I bought it this spring). I test rode a friend’s 996 for a week (500 km) before I pulled the trigger on mine and it was fitted with 190. It felt more stable when leaning, but a little heavier. I liked it because it gave me a sense of confidence on wider roads. But as soon as you hit mountain twisties, man, it’s a b!tch to move around.

Interestingly enough, after 4500 km on the 916, I have a 1 cm chicken strip on the rear. Other riders told me it was a little harder to go all the way with 180’s on these machines, than with 190’s. I guess it’s due to a flatter profile, rim width being unchanged, the 180’s are kinda stretched across or something.

No chicken strips at all on the Supersport’s 180. It feels like a 125 moped, in comparison. Engineers have made it easy to lean on this bike, it’s truly incredible! I absolutely love the feeling when changing from one to the other (both ways). Two different eras and concepts.
 
#22 ·
Gosh darn! If only I wasn't uneducated and scared, I could see the light, and agree with the dude at the tire shop. Maybe he'd let me hang out with him. But for heaven' sake, do not question the reasoning behind doing anything the self proclaimed Clued Up are doing.

The first KTM 390 Dukes came out with a 150 rear tire. Honda, Kaw, Yam were all putting a140 on the back of their small bikes. They were all running the same width rim. A lot of us 390 owners did go down to a 140. The 140, in that instance put more rubber on the road than the 150, that was in a pinch. In my eyes, when you put too wide a tire on too narrow of a rim it looks like 2 pounds of sausage in a 1 pound bag. But a lot of guys like that look. I don't buy stuff to look at, nor impress anyone.

I bought a really nice minty '01 929 a couple of years ago. It's just like the one I bought in 2001. It had the original tires on it, which were all dried out and hard. The back tire that I put on it was a 190, just like the original. But the 929 has a 6" rim.
 
#24 ·
Non (native)English speaker here, sorry!

😂
Guillaume, your English is superb. I am always amazed at your natural fluency and wish I had one quarter of your vocabulary in French. I spend a lot of time SCUBA diving with my French brothers from various parts of your national government and they are so gracious towards my efforts to pick up and correctly pronounce common French phrases but your command of the English language is truly admirable. Plus your posts are always consistently value-added and even-keeled.....Thanks for being a great member here!
 
#26 ·
Theory is all well and good, but I prefer to test and decide for myself. No two of us are riding the same roads at the same time, and with the same style.

I've read the pro's and con's on here from people with much more experience than me, and think it's worth giving the 190 a go.

After a few hundred miles I'll know what's best for me, on my roads and the way I ride. And I'll enjoy the process no matter the outcome.

But if you don't experiment you can only go off theory, and you'll never know for sure. I already know that my next set will be Rosso Corsa's...I don't know what width yet. After that I should know what to stick with.

Also, next week I'm picking up a '14 Multistrada. If I really don't like the tyres on my SS I can take them off and save them for the MS.:D
 
#27 ·
Theory is all well and good, but I prefer to test and decide for myself. No two of us are riding the same roads at the same time, and with the same style.

I've read the pro's and con's on here from people with much more experience than me, and think it's worth giving the 190 a go.
Well done, Dox, and good on ya for relying on the forum members with a little more experience and making the best informed decision possible. That's what this forum is all about and I'm glad our members are more than happy to help!

Look forward to your review.
 
#37 ·
So, I’ve now put 200 miles on with the new tyres, and this is what I’ve learned.
From brand new after picking her up from the dealer in the wet, the traction control lit up twice on the way home despite being super-cautious. Not scrubbed in along with reduced contact patch (each time the TC triggered the bike was fully upright) I wasn’t surprised. No shocks there then.
For the next few rides out, which were just short rides of 20-30 miles, I was worried I’d made the wrong decision. Turn in and directional change were markedly worse, in that more effort was required...it felt like it had lost its flickability. Saturday morning before traffic was out, I went for a ride. It set off the same...but after a few miles it started to come back in. Meaning it started to feel natural again. I forgot about any extra effort and it started to flow like it used to, and I felt relieved that I may not need to change the tyres straight away.
After work today, I went out on my MS to test the touring screen that came with it. After that I wanted to go back out on Gina to see if the feel was genuinely back, or was it that my expectation level was decreasing. Well I’m glad to say, that the 190 is staying on. Round my test route roundabouts the lean angle is crazy. I could’ve put my knee down easily with degrees to go but was only wearing jeans and don’t want to skin my knee in the name of testing. The flickability has returned now they’re scrubbed in. Or maybe I’ve just mentally recalibrated the efforts required...either way, I’m enjoying the ride the same as I was, and can definitely attest to there being more lean angle available. I’m looking forward to an extended ride out to test over a range of roads and surfaces.
The first picture is my first one of Gina and Vito together (beauty and the beast). The second is of the tyre on Saturday morning...I think that shows the confidence to start to accelerate early coming out of the lean.
 

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#40 ·
Nope, got the 2 right though - Diablo 2s;

"Gina was in to get the exhaust valve sorted out under warranty and new tyres.
When I told them I wanted new tyres, I said a 190 rear...I expected them to put Diablo 3s back on, but they’re Diablo 2s. I don’t mind as my brother has them on his XR and likes them. It’s good to experiment.
It was also good getting back on her after the Scrambler courtesy bike...she feels like a precision weapon in comparison. Fantastic."
 
#43 ·
I know we've talked about this before...several times...but I want to add that I really like the Rosso III's. I think they're an excellent tire. My plan is to replace my OEM with them again. However, my mileage is a little less than I wanted. I have maybe another 1,000 miles left. In fact, the SS is in the garage NOT BEING RIDDEN for that very reason. We have the Second Annual Meet in a couple weeks and I need to ensure I have proper tread left for it.
 
#50 ·
Recently I've been using my Multi more as the weather hasn't been great...and the 1200 is a bit addictive. But it's great to get back out on the SS.

Regarding the tyres, it's noticeable that they need more warming up; moving from upright takes more effort. But this tails off as they get some heat into them. Then they feel really secure. Lean angle is markedly more attainable...I've still got maybe 12mm of chicken strips left despite getting to angles I previously couldn't. I can only wonder what a 190 Corsa would be like.
 
#51 ·
Had some time for some light reading and wound up here!

Just curious - the '55' profile is a percentage of the tire width and not a measurement. Therefore, I presume the arse end sits a bit higher with a 190 and this should sharpen the bikes turning slightly, which should offset any slowness from the wider tire?

Presumably, the speedometer would be slightly out also? So... would a 190/50 be a similar profile to the 180/55?
 
#54 ·
Ok I have the 190 on the OEM 5.5 rim ( changed to this on the earliest opportunity). Most of the time the 190 is fitted to a 6'' rim and the 55 being a % of the width in Hight giving you the ark / curve of the tyre determining the quickness of the dip in. To answer your question:
I presume the arse end sits a bit higher with a 190 and this should sharpen the bikes turning slightly, which should offset any slowness from the wider tire?
what you get with the 190 on a 5.5 rim is the same Hight as if on a 6" rim and virtually the same dip in (Curve) But it goes further giving you about an extra 10mm of contact point as you lean over meaning you get to have a greater lean angle while still having a contact patch. Also the contact patch is bigger at full lean as the side wall collapses and flattens more than it would on a 6" rim. All good stuff !!!. The down side is that the sidewall collapses more while at extreme lean :grin2:. I don't find this a problem as the Rosso Corsa 11 I use can handle it fine. I even contacted Pirelli way back who said that its fine and common practice in racing circles. Hope this helps
 
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