South African Review

7399 Views 35 Replies 13 Participants Last post by amoslws, Aug 20, 2017

stavros

Discussion Starter · Jul 20, 2017

Just shows that horse power is not the criterion.

1 - 20 of 36 Posts

Ventura17SS

· #2 · Jul 20, 2017

Good God, I don't care if that green thing has 75 more horsepower and costs half what the Supersport does. Interesting neither mentioned weight. In any event, the ugly factor of the Kawasaki is off the charts. The typical Asian design factor...make it look like it's in a video game. No Thank You.

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amoslws

· #3 · Jul 20, 2017 (Edited)

Yeah, I know both these guys from my local biking industry.
Unfortunately there's a lot more to the SS than what was mentioned, shame ducati didn't ask me to do the road review since ducati know me well enough here in SA. Also the kawasaki is the wrong bike to compare against.
Difference in HP is not a biggie, where does that hp actually sit on the power curve, no use it kicks in around 7000rpm.

I can tell you this little SS will drop most (non racer) bikes in acceleration, especially with the quickshifter.
You only need to open up the SS in 3rd gear and run it through the rev range, things approach pretty quickly. It can get 100kph to 175kph very quickly in 3rd gear.
If you haven't tried it, trust the engine robustness and take it upto the rev limiter. Go feel that then tell me how the kawasaki does it.....That difference my mate is known as great character, something inline four jap bikes don't have and will likely never possess.
I have chatted with a few of these kawa owners and they sell them within a year because of it's mid range handling....and that my mate is where the little ducati SS comes into its own, its absolute splendour in the way it handles surpasses any jap bike I have ridden.

EDIT: I watched the program on TV a few weeks ago and only re-watched the video after writing my little moan. So go try 3rd gear and open that throttle.

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Rhino

· #4 · Jul 20, 2017

Lol but I do love that guys reviews I especially like his test ride on the H2R

se7en

· #5 · Jul 20, 2017

As an owner of both of these bikes, I think I can speak to this a bit better than most. It's funny...when the Kawi first came out, it was reviewed heavily and most said that it was a sport tourer with a heavy lean towards the sport side. Now that the SS has come out, and comparing them side by side, I would say that it is more toward the touring side. The SS is just smaller and lighter. Period. Obviously, we are on a Ducati site, so the bias from this forum will be heavy toward our beloved SS. But putting aside by own personal bias, you cannot simply say that the Ducati is better and that there are intangibles that make it so. I'm here to tell you that the Kawi is a formidable bike. It does everything great. It has ALL the tools, too. Horsepower that is linear, ABS and traction that is lean sensitive, LED headlights, upright ergos, all day seat, adjustable windscreen...and bulletproof Japanese build quality. Seriously, the Kawi is arguably a better all around bike than our SS...or ANY bike for that matter, so lets not shoot it down too quickly. And personally, I really like the look of it...in black, not green.

Other than being lighter and more svelt, where the Ducati is best is in that sexy factor. That "make you look twice" as it goes by factor. Other than that, the Kawi beats it on just about every statistical category. Let's face it, we are here with our SS's because we love the look of a Ducati. We love the sound of a Ducati. We love the ownership experience of a Ducati. Finally, Ducati produced a great practical bike that wasn't a Multi. But, it's only a great bike for their line of bikes. When compared with all bikes across the spectrum, and no bias included, it's a mid pack bike. Just is. Now don't get me wrong. I LOVE MY DUCATI and as I've said before, it's quickly becoming my favorite bike ever...which includes my Ninja 1000 (Z1000SX). There is only one reason for that...it has that Italian it factor. It just feels great, sounds great, and handles great...Italians do it better...somehow.

Getting back to sound for a second...this will be a biased observation, too. I love how my Ducati's have sounded, BUT I will always love the sound of an inline four cranked up to about 13,000 RPM screaming down the road!!! Tell me you don't, too!?!

There. My unbiased opinion on these two. The Kawi wins on practically every statistical category, but ends up tied (or in second place for some) because the Italian it factor carries so much weight. That is what the reviewers were trying to say at the end of the video.

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se7en

· #6 · Jul 20, 2017 (Edited)

@amoslws - your statement about mid range torque on the Kawi simply isn't accurate. The Kawi is a BEAST through the mid range...just like the SS. It pulls like a train. In fact, I used to make jokes about the bike being an automatic. I would set the gear in 3rd and go as low as 5 MPH, and it would pick itself backup with no issue or hesitation. It has a very strong mid range, IMO. In fact, I would say that a 10MPH roll on speed test in 3rd, the Kawi will be neck and neck to the SS...if not faster.

Reactions: 1

amoslws

· #7 · Jul 20, 2017 (Edited)

se7en said:
@amoslws - your statement about mid range torque on the Kawi simply isn't accurate. The Kawi is a BEAST through the mid range...just like the SS. It pulls like a train. In fact, I used to make jokes about the bike being an automatic. I would set the gear in 3rd and go as low as 5 MPH, and it would pick itself backup with no issue or hesitation. It has a very strong mid range, IMO. In fact, I would say that a 10MPH roll on speed test in 3rd, the Kawi will be neck and neck to the SS...if not faster.

I mentioned handling, nothing about torque when I wrote on the kawa. All I stated was that many owners of the same bike have told me they got rid of it because of its handling at mid range. So are they wrong to inadvertently agree that it was not worth keeping. I do get the feeling we ride differently in my country as opposed to your region. We throttle bikes big time here, large open spaces at fast paces...most persons cruise at 100mph and more. That is generally a more relaxed pace. So here many folk have mentioned the kawa is sh!t, I like what they say so I agree with them. A big engine means nothing if the rest of the bike handles like a sloppy sh!t. what good is hp when its difficult to handle and enjoy the ride.

amoslws

· #8 · Jul 20, 2017 (Edited)

Name me an inline four cylinder that has character. Come on guys they are as predictable as the milkmans delivery schedule. Yes they are boring and characterless. Wow all that engine at fcuking 10 000, well what use is that, really. I have had my fair few jap bikes and compared to my sweet little SS they are so [email protected] boring. In fact I took one of my in line fours for a spin to bring the oil up to temperature the other day and although I love the suzuki 1250 for touring, I must tell you I was so [email protected] bored on it. I got no feeling of exhilaration compared to everytime I crank up this SS. Yes the SS is definitely under powered but it's still a great fun bike that makes me feel good whenever I ride it.

se7en

· #9 · Jul 20, 2017

The handling of the Kawi is good enough for me to drag knee any day, any where, all day long. It isnt as good as the SS, but that's because the SS is lighter with a lower center of gravity. The SS is closer to sport for sure, and the Kawi is closer to tourer. I'm just saying it shouldn't be overlooked quite so easily. And, personally, I and many others enjoy the "boring" characteristics of an inline, bulletproof, reliable, 4 cylinder. I can appreciate their ingenuity and engineering mastery to build a bike that is as reliable as the sun coming up. As an engineer, I'm surprised you are so quick to dismiss them. I am a fan of all bikes. I LOVE MY SS, but can equally love and appreciate a Japanese bike. In fact, when buying the SS, my dealer had a new 2017 Honda Fireblade sitting there. I said to my salesman, "if I were 10 years younger, I'd be buying that bike". I was and continue to be impressed by Japanese artistry in their bikes.

But getting back to the Kawi and your friends statement about the mid range handling. You have stated that there isn't many twisties around your area and you have to travel quite some distance to find it. If that's the case, who cares if it can handle? All bikes can go fast in a straight line!!

Whatever, I don't want to argue. The Kawi is a d4mn good bike and arguably better than the SS in practically every statistical category...except the Italian "it" factor.

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amoslws

· #10 · Jul 20, 2017

Rhino said:
Lol but I do love that guys reviews I especially like his test ride on the H2R

Reactions: 1

DucMan

· #11 · Jul 20, 2017

Lack of twisty roads around you is the perfect excuse to go on a trip to some of the most ideal roads. I know guys that religiously go out to the Dragon. But of course going to a destination that far out for some people just isn't an option. Buying this high caliber of bike... I like to think it is

se7en

· #12 · Jul 21, 2017

DucMan said:
Lack of twisty roads around you is the perfect excuse to go on a trip to some of the most ideal roads. I know guys that religiously go out to the Dragon. But of course going to a destination that far out for some people just isn't an option. Buying this high caliber of bike... I like to think it is

I know I'm spoiled, and I understand the fascination with the Dragon. Its a 30 minute ride to get there for me. I've ridden it probably 400 times in my years, but as with all things, it gets old and stale. I still enjoy a run or two occasionally, but the traffic and LEO's have made it a crap shoot as to what the experience will be like. Living in the mountains of East TN, there are SO many roads around me that are similar and much less traveled...

>

My signature is a pic of a couple turns of the the Dragon, BTW.

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John

· #13 · Jul 21, 2017

se7en said:
The handling of the Kawi is good enough for me to drag knee any day, any where, all day long. It isnt as good as the SS, but that's because the SS is lighter with a lower center of gravity. The SS is closer to sport for sure, and the Kawi is closer to tourer. I'm just saying it shouldn't be overlooked quite so easily. And, personally, I and many others enjoy the "boring" characteristics of an inline, bulletproof, reliable, 4 cylinder. I can appreciate their ingenuity and engineering mastery to build a bike that is as reliable as the sun coming up. As an engineer, I'm surprised you are so quick to dismiss them. I am a fan of all bikes. I LOVE MY SS, but can equally love and appreciate a Japanese bike. In fact, when buying the SS, my dealer had a new 2017 Honda Fireblade sitting there. I said to my salesman, "if I were 10 years younger, I'd be buying that bike". I was and continue to be impressed by Japanese artistry in their bikes.

But getting back to the Kawi and your friends statement about the mid range handling. You have stated that there isn't many twisties around your area and you have to travel quite some distance to find it. If that's the case, who cares if it can handle? All bikes can go fast in a straight line!!

Whatever, I don't want to argue. The Kawi is a d4mn good bike and arguably better than the SS in practically every statistical category...except the Italian "it" factor.

I'm feeling rather down after this 'discussion'. Ride regularly with 2 guys on Ninja 1000's, and while if I push it hard (not an SS owner) I can stay with them into and through the corners, but exiting the corner they can just out grunt me every time. Now being aware they are riding no mid-range power heaps of handling crap ...... I feel really dejected :crying:.

melba

· #14 · Jul 21, 2017

IMHO trying to compare any Jap bike to any Ducati (forget all the technology and performance B/S), is like comparing the fat Emperor Tojo to the outrageously gorgeous Sophia Loren (for those of you not old enough to remember, she was a stunningly gorgeous Italian actress) - NO CONTEST!!! I have owned both Jap and Ducati (still do), and I can tell you the Jap very rarely, if ever, makes it's way out of the garage these days as I find it totally uninspiring in comparison and I would much rather ride the Italian sex-kitten - Sorry Tojo

Bigwaves1

· #15 · Jul 21, 2017

Who cares about reviews? These bikes are not even in the same league. When i look at my Duck getting in my car going to work i always think that is a sexy bike. If i had a kaw i would be thinking that is fugly. I have many bikes in my garage, none sexier than the duck.

John

· #16 · Jul 21, 2017 (Edited)

2

melba said:
IMHO trying to compare any Jap bike to any Ducati (forget all the technology and performance B/S), is like comparing the fat Emperor Tojo to the outrageously gorgeous Sophia Loren (for those of you not old enough to remember, she was a stunningly gorgeous Italian actress) - NO CONTEST!!!

Hey, Sophia .....

Sorry, devil made me do it >

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se7en

· #17 · Jul 21, 2017

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1uglybastard

· #18 · Jul 21, 2017 (Edited)

amoslws said:
Name me an inline four cylinder that has character. Come on guys they are as predictable as the milkmans delivery schedule. Yes they are boring and characterless. Wow all that engine at fcuking 10 000, well what use is that, really. I have had my fair few jap bikes and compared to my sweet little SS they are so [email protected] boring. In fact I took one of my in line fours for a spin to bring the oil up to temperature the other day and although I love the suzuki 1250 for touring, I must tell you I was so [email protected] bored on it. I got no feeling of exhilaration compared to everytime I crank up this SS. Yes the SS is definitely under powered but it's still a great fun bike that makes me feel good whenever I ride it.

define "character" when it comes to a motorcycle. I always hear Duc owners say that about Ducati, but I don't know what they mean. I've stopped saying it myself because I can't define it.

The "character" that I just experienced with my 1100 EVO, which has 22,000 miles on it, a few minutes ago was a shitty shifter that couldn't find neutral no matter what I did. When I experience this shifting problem, which is random, I want to say goodbye to Ducati forever, but it's se7en's "it" factor that makes me keep it. Plus, I've put almost all of those miles on it, so I have a history with it.

1uglybastard

· #19 · Jul 21, 2017

se7en said:
I know I'm spoiled, and I understand the fascination with the Dragon. Its a 30 minute ride to get there for me. I've ridden it probably 400 times in my years, but as with all things, it gets old and stale. I still enjoy a run or two occasionally, but the traffic and LEO's have made it a crap shoot as to what the experience will be like. Living in the mountains of East TN, there are SO many roads around me that are similar and much less traveled...

>

My signature is a pic of a couple turns of the the Dragon, BTW.

next time I'm in your neck of the woods, I may ask you to map out these roads for me. I've thought about riding up to the Dragon again, but it's about an 11 hour ride for me., and I don't want to go through all that for a ticket.

Reactions: 1

1uglybastard

· #20 · Jul 21, 2017

se7en said:

she's a beauty, without a doubt. I'm into more comfortable, sport riding, however, and I've developed a Less is More state of mind over the last couple of years, so if I don't get the SS, I may bump it down a couple of notches and get this

The only thing is, I will miss maintaining my Monster. I've learned to appreciate the valve adjustments and other maintenance my Duc needs. What I won't miss are the flaws: crap shifting, clutch fluid overheating, cold weather hesitation to start.

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